Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Further more, as pointed out by you and others on this thread, trying to change human cultural practices, even if the recommended change would result in great benefit to those who adopt the change is a doomed strategy.

First, no one has the right to tell someone else how to live their life. This is the basis of human rights and hopefully in the future we humans will come to accept this principal, which is essential for our peaceful coexistence.

Any cultural change must take place within that cultural context. As long as any part of a culture accepts the concept that one life has more value than another, there will be "rationed care" within their health system. I have faith that within the basics of most religions, their concept of equality can be referenced to move toward more rational health care. I have long advocated that the best problem solutions come from within an impacted group - not "experts from afar."

.

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

this article and discussion about the down-side of high Vitamin D levels makes specific reference to cytokine responses.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Vitamin D may exacerbate autoimmune disease
Date:4/8/2009

Deficiency in vitamin D has been widely regarded as contributing to autoimmune disease, but a review appearing in Autoimmunity Reviews explains that low levels of vitamin D in patients with autoimmune disease may be a result rather than a cause of disease and that supplementing with vitamin D may actually exacerbate autoimmune disease.

Authored by a team of researchers at the California-based non-profit Autoimmunity Research Foundation, the paper goes on to point out that molecular biologists have long known that the form of vitamin D derived from food and supplements, 25-hydroxyvitamin D (25-D), is a secosteroid rather than a vitamin. Like corticosteroid medications, vitamin D may provide short-term relief by lowering inflammation but may exacerbate disease symptoms over the long-term.

The insights are based on molecular research showing that 25-D inactivates rather than activates its native receptor - the Vitamin D nuclear receptor or VDR. Once associated solely with calcium metabolism, the VDR is now known to transcribe at least 913 genes and largely control the innate immune response by expressing the bulk of the body's antimicrobial peptides, natural antimicrobials that target bacteria.

Written under the guidance of professor Trevor Marshall of Murdoch University, Western Australia, the paper contends that 25-D's actions must be considered in light of recent research on the Human Microbiome. Such research shows that bacteria are far more pervasive than previously thought 90% of cells in the body are estimated to be non-human increasing the likelihood that autoimmune diseases are caused by persistent pathogens, many of which have yet to be named or have their DNA characterized.

Marshall and team explain that by deactivating the VDR and subsequently the immune response, 25-D lowers the inflammation caused by many of these bacteria but allows them to spread more easily in the long-run. They outline how long-term harm caused by high levels of 25-D has been missed because the bacteria implicated in autoimmune disease grow very slowly. For example, a higher incidence in brain lesions, allergies, and atopy in response to vitamin D supplementation have been noted only after decades of supplementation with the secosteroid.

Furthermore, low levels of 25-D are frequently noted in patients with autoimmune disease, leading to a current consensus that a deficiency of the secosteroid may contribute to the autoimmune disease process. However, Marshall and team explain that these low levels of 25-D are a result, rather than a cause, of the disease process. Indeed, Marshall's research shows that in autoimmune disease, 25-D levels are naturally down-regulated in response to VDR dysregulation by chronic pathogens. Under such circumstances, supplementation with extra vitamin D is not only counterproductive but harmful, as it slows the ability of the immune system to deal with such bacteria.

The team points out the importance of examining alternate models of vitamin D metabolism. "Vitamin D is currently being recommended at historically unprecedented doses," states Amy Proal, one of the paper's co-authors. "Yet at the same time, the rate of nearly every autoimmune disease continues to escalate."

Contact: Paul Albert
palbert@autoimmunityresearch.org
917-887-1815
Autoimmunity Research Foundation
Source:Eurekalert

http://www.bio-medicine.org/biology-news-1/Vitamin-D-may-exacerbate-autoimmune-disease-7924-2/

------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are more Vitamin D articles at their foundation's publications and presentations page: http://mpkb.mp-dev.com/doku.php/home:publications

.

[kiwibird]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

I am very happy to agree that Vitamin D looks as though it will help us fight influenza. I have several versions of Vitamin tablets and would like it spelt out whether they actually have viable amounts of vitamin D. They do not specify D2 or D3 so I am assuming D2.

Fish Oil Tablets 1000mg. Only states Omega 3. Does this have any Vit. D? ..and would it have Vitamin A?

Multivitamin Vit D3 Cholecalciferol (D3) 5mcg (also has vit A 2,000IU)

Calcium and Vit D Tablets (Taste disgusting by the way) Vitamin D 100IU(no not 1000!) And calcium sodium lactate 450mg and calcium phosphate 105mg.

These are all available locally - but don't seem to be anywhere near the vitamin available quantities suggested. Am I right?

Perhaps we should start another thread. We seem to have gotten a little off track. I would like to see something showing how to implement all this advice.

[cartski]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

this article and discussion about the down-side of high Vitamin D levels makes specific reference to cytokine responses.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Furthermore, low levels of 25-D are frequently noted in patients with autoimmune disease, leading to a current consensus that a deficiency of the secosteroid may contribute to the autoimmune disease process. However, Marshall and team explain that these low levels of 25-D are a result, rather than a cause, of the disease process. Indeed, Marshall's research shows that in autoimmune disease, 25-D levels are naturally down-regulated in response to VDR dysregulation by chronic pathogens. Under such circumstances, supplementation with extra vitamin D is not only counterproductive but harmful, as it slows the ability of the immune system to deal with such bacteria.

The team points out the importance of examining alternate models of vitamin D metabolism. "Vitamin D is currently being recommended at historically unprecedented doses," states Amy Proal, one of the paper's co-authors. "Yet at the same time, the rate of nearly every autoimmune disease continues to escalate."

So assuming someone could determine the appropriate dosage level by body weight and underlying conditions, we would still need a method to monitor levels on a daily or weekly basis, given the supplementation and sunlight exposures.

A blood suger-like testing kit?

J.

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

So assuming someone could determine the appropriate dosage level by body weight and underlying conditions, we would still need a method to monitor levels on a daily or weekly basis, given the supplementation and sunlight exposures.

A blood suger-like testing kit?

J.

What a good idea. Given that few labs can currently do an accurate test, perhaps a re-active color-coded type test could be developed.

Another question is if the test is looking at levels in circulating blood, is there a way to measure the "D" in the "D"-tank?

Note that the above article was about people with autoimmune diseases, but they still make some interesting points, like the VDR dysregulation can be impacted by chronic pathogens.

There are just no easy answers.

.

[cartski]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Are there indicators of vit D deficiency in the NEJM article about Mexican cases? (I can't find it.)

Is there a socio-economic gradient to these cases?

The CIDRAP report talks about antibiotic treatment for pneumonia - is a side-effect of antibiotics a sudden depletion of vit D?

J.

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Are there indicators of vit D deficiency in the NEJM article about Mexican cases? (I can't find it.).....

One study that might be possible, is to find current novel H1N1 cases that had recent Vit D tests (probably very few) and gather information on the progression of their illness.

.

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

this article and discussion about the down-side of high Vitamin D levels makes specific reference to cytokine responses.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Vitamin D may exacerbate autoimmune disease
Date:4/8/2009

Deficiency in vitamin D has been widely regarded as contributing to autoimmune disease, but a review appearing in Autoimmunity Reviews explains that low levels of vitamin D in patients with autoimmune disease may be a result rather than a cause of disease and that supplementing with vitamin D may actually exacerbate autoimmune disease.

Authored by a team of researchers at the California-based non-profit Autoimmunity Research Foundation, the paper goes on to point out that molecular biologists have long known that the form of vitamin D derived from food and supplements, 25-hydroxyvitamin D (25-D), is a secosteroid rather than a vitamin. Like corticosteroid medications, vitamin D may provide short-term relief by lowering inflammation but may exacerbate disease symptoms over the long-term.

The insights are based on molecular research showing that 25-D inactivates rather than activates its native receptor - the Vitamin D nuclear receptor or VDR. Once associated solely with calcium metabolism, the VDR is now known to transcribe at least 913 genes and largely control the innate immune response by expressing the bulk of the body's antimicrobial peptides, natural antimicrobials that target bacteria.

Written under the guidance of professor Trevor Marshall of Murdoch University, Western Australia, the paper contends that 25-D's actions must be considered in light of recent research on the Human Microbiome. Such research shows that bacteria are far more pervasive than previously thought 90% of cells in the body are estimated to be non-human increasing the likelihood that autoimmune diseases are caused by persistent pathogens, many of which have yet to be named or have their DNA characterized.

Marshall and team explain that by deactivating the VDR and subsequently the immune response, 25-D lowers the inflammation caused by many of these bacteria but allows them to spread more easily in the long-run. They outline how long-term harm caused by high levels of 25-D has been missed because the bacteria implicated in autoimmune disease grow very slowly. For example, a higher incidence in brain lesions, allergies, and atopy in response to vitamin D supplementation have been noted only after decades of supplementation with the secosteroid.

Furthermore, low levels of 25-D are frequently noted in patients with autoimmune disease, leading to a current consensus that a deficiency of the secosteroid may contribute to the autoimmune disease process. However, Marshall and team explain that these low levels of 25-D are a result, rather than a cause, of the disease process. Indeed, Marshall's research shows that in autoimmune disease, 25-D levels are naturally down-regulated in response to VDR dysregulation by chronic pathogens. Under such circumstances, supplementation with extra vitamin D is not only counterproductive but harmful, as it slows the ability of the immune system to deal with such bacteria.

The team points out the importance of examining alternate models of vitamin D metabolism. "Vitamin D is currently being recommended at historically unprecedented doses," states Amy Proal, one of the paper's co-authors. "Yet at the same time, the rate of nearly every autoimmune disease continues to escalate."

Contact: Paul Albert
palbert@autoimmunityresearch.org
917-887-1815
Autoimmunity Research Foundation
Source:Eurekalert

http://www.bio-medicine.org/biology-news-1/Vitamin-D-may-exacerbate-autoimmune-disease-7924-2/

------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are more Vitamin D articles at their foundation's publications and presentations page: http://mpkb.mp-dev.com/doku.php/home:publications

.

I have spent the afternoon viewing two presentations given by Dr. Marshall recently in China with an eye to understanding his point of view.

What I can say is this man has a good grasp of the VDR and its role in human health and disease but his approach to restoring health via the VDR is entirely different from what is the consensus within mainstream medicine as well as expressed on this thread.

While I do not understand Dr. Marshall's insights and discoveries well enough to translate them for you what I will venture to say is that he proposes that in addition to the normal bacterial flora we all know about that live on our skin and within the gut, there are a large number of bacteria-like organisms, many of which being "L forms" that live within the cells of the body in a symbiotic and in some cases parasitic relationship with us. These organisms are very small and hard to see or stain using standard light microscopy but are apparent using the electron microscope.

Dr. Marshall posits that some of these intercelluar organisms interact with our DNA and the VDR to cause a plethora of common human diseases including all those mentioned on this thread previously in association with vitamin D deficiency.

His foundation has developed a staged treatment protocol employing very low doses of the antibiotics minocycline, zithromycin and clindimycin that are administered by protocol in a staged fashion designed to rid the body gradually of these intercellular pathogens without causing serious adverse events related to cell apotheosis and cytokine storm. The treatment process can take a long time, in fact a year or two.

There are many benefits of doing this according to Dr. Marshall who stated that this impression can be easily gained by a review of the patient dairies maintained upon his foundation's website. Access to these is restricted to registered health care professionals only although they are open to anyone with this credential.

I have contacted Dr. Marshall's representative by email and invited the doctor to visit this thread and share his views with us given the fact that they are so different from those expressed by virtually every post save the one by our senior editor and moderator AD who brought this viewpoint to our attention initially.

I hope he will join our conversation as his POV is truly unique and very different from the mainstream.

Grattan Woodson, MD

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

thank you for spending your time researching this issue.

We need to know about all the negative aspects of higher Vitamin D levels, especially since there are so many autoimmune diseases.

The more I read about this subject the more complexities I find.

.

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

What a good idea. Given that few labs can currently do an accurate test, perhaps a re-active color-coded type test could be developed.

Another question is if the test is looking at levels in circulating blood, is there a way to measure the "D" in the "D"-tank?

Note that the above article was about people with autoimmune diseases, but they still make some interesting points, like the VDR dysregulation can be impacted by chronic pathogens.

There are just no easy answers.

.

With regard the being able to measure the D in the D tank, the answer is NO.

A few researchers have tried to do this but they have encountered problems doing so. Ideally, one could biopsy fat tissue from anywhere on the body, measure the level of vitamin D stored there and then based upon a knowledge of the percentage of body weight composed of fat calculate total body stores of vitamin D.

This is the theory but some fat tissue apparently have higher vitamin D levels than others. Some of the vitamin D stored in fat may not be as available was that stored in other places.

So, this is why we rely on the serum 25 OH vit D level as a proxy for available whole body vitamin D stores, the quantity of supplements taken and the sun exposure received. The reason for this is because 25 OH vit D has a half-life in the serum of around 90 days meaning it needs to be replaced from one or a combination of these 3 sources continuously to maintain consistent levels.

If the supply of pre-25 OH vit D is inadequate, then the level of 25 OH vit D in the serum will fall. Therefore assuming that the liver is healthy enough to convert vitamin D2 and D3 to 25 OH vit D, then the serum 25 OH vit D level is the best measure of the availability vitamin D2 and D3 from all sources including that stored in the "tank".

GW

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

One study that might be possible, is to find current novel H1N1 cases that had recent Vit D tests (probably very few) and gather information on the progression of their illness.

.

Laboratory Results

At the time of admission, all 16 tested patients had elevated lactate dehydrogenase levels; levels in 10 patients exceeded 1000 IU per liter (range, 1086 to 6309). Ten of the 16 patients had increased creatine kinase levels, which were above 1000 IU per liter (range, 1099 to 5122) in 5 patients. Eleven of all 18 patients (61%) had lymphopenia (<1000 lymphocytes per cubic millimeter), 2 patients had more than 10,000 leukocytes per cubic millimeter, and 2 patients had mild thrombocytopenia at admission. Patient 3 had myocardial ischemia, as revealed on electrocardiography, with myocardial infarction documented on autopsy. Three patients had elevated creatinine levels (1.8 to 4.6 mg per deciliter [159 to 407 ?mol per liter]) at admission. Four patients had D-dimer levels greater than 1000 IU per liter, and 11 patients had elevated aminotransferase levels (aspartate aminotransferase, 50 to 65 U per liter; alanine aminotransferase, 43 to 147 U per liter). Results of other routine tests were within normal limits.

In addition, all had x-ray evidence of widespread viral pneumonia on admission and were short of breath.

Above is the lab data upon admission the of the 18 patients treated at "INER the Mexican national tertiary care and research center devoted to respiratory diseases", which is a world class medical facility located in Mexico City whose doctors wrote the article published online today in the New England Journal of Medicine.

There is no data here that supports of refutes the vitamin D hypothesis we have been discussing on this thread.

Seven out of the eighteen patients admitted to INER with documented novel H1N1 died in the hospital. What is clear to me from the lab results provided upon admission to the INER is that most of these patients were already critically ill showing signs of multi-organ failure and probably beyond survival at that time they arrived there. These lab results indicate that some of the patients were in renal failure, in others their muscle tissue was breaking down, some had liver damage, one had a heart attack before entering INER who died later, in several others there is evidence that their blood was clotting in their arteries and veins. These are all very serious conditions and typical of what was seen in 1918 during the Spanish Flu in the young who died rapidly from that virus.

The fact that the doctors and staff at this facility were able to save 11 out of the original 18 is quite remarkable and a credit to their professionalism, expertize and devotion to duty.

Link: http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0904252

Grattan Woodson, MD

[Sally Furniss]

Re: Cytokine Storm &amp; Vitamin D relationship?

Influence of season and latitude on the cutaneous synthesis of vitamin D3: exposure to winter sunlight in Boston and Edmonton will not promote vitamin D3 synthesis in human skin

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/con...tract/67/2/373

AR Webb, L Kline and MF Holick
Vitamin D, Skin, and Bone Research Laboratory, Boston University Medical School, Massachusetts 02118.

Sunlight has long been recognized as a major provider of vitamin D for humans; radiation in the UVB (290-315 nm) portion of the solar spectrum photolyzes 7-dehydrocholesterol in the skin to previtamin D3, which, in turn, is converted by a thermal process to vitamin D3.

Latitude and season affect both the quantity and quality of solar radiation reaching the earth's surface, especially in the UVB region of the spectrum, but little is known about how these influence the ability of sunlight to synthesize vitamin D3 in skin.

A model has been developed to evaluate the effect of seasonal and latitudinal changes on the potential of sunlight to initiate cutaneous production of vitamin D3. Human skin or [3 alpha-3H]7-dehydrocholesterol exposed to sunlight on cloudless days in Boston (42.2 degrees N) from November through February produced no previtamin D3.

In Edmonton (52 degrees N) this ineffective winter period extended from October through March.

Further south (34 degrees N and 18 degrees N), sunlight effectively photoconverted 7- dehydrocholesterol to previtamin D3 in the middle of winter.

These results quantify the dramatic influence of changes in solar UVB radiation on cutaneous vitamin D3 synthesis and indicate the latitudinal increase in the length of the "vitamin D winter" during which dietary supplementation of the vitamin may be advisable.

[kiwibird]

Re: Cytokine Storm &amp; Vitamin D relationship?

For adults, the 5-?g (200 IU) vitamin D recommended dietary allowance may prevent osteomalacia in the absence of sunlight, but more is needed to help prevent osteoporosis and secondary hyperparathyroidism. Other benefits of vitamin D supplementation are implicated epidemiologically: prevention of some cancers, osteoarthritis progression, multiple sclerosis, and hypertension. Total-body sun exposure easily provides the equivalent of 250 ?g (10000 IU) vitamin D/d, suggesting that this is a physiologic limit. Sailors in US submarines are deprived of environmentally acquired vitamin D equivalent to 20?50 ?g (800?2000 IU)/d. The assembled data from many vitamin D supplementation studies reveal a curve for vitamin D dose versus serum 25-hydroxyvitamin D [25(OH)D] response that is surprisingly flat up to 250 ?g (10000 IU) vitamin D/d. To ensure that serum 25(OH)D concentrations exceed 100 nmol/L, a total vitamin D supply of 100 ?g (4000 IU)/d is required. Except in those with conditions causing hypersensitivity, there is no evidence of adverse effects with serum 25(OH)D concentrations <140 nmol/L, which require a total vitamin D supply of 250 ?g (10000 IU)/d to attain. Published cases of vitamin D toxicity with hypercalcemia, for which the 25(OH)D concentration and vitamin D dose are known, all involve intake of >=1000 ?g (40000 IU)/d. Because vitamin D is potentially toxic, intake of >25 ?g (1000 IU)/d has been avoided even though the weight of evidence shows that the currently accepted, no observed adverse effect limit of 50 ?g (2000 IU)/d is too low by at least 5-fold.....

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/69/5/842

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm &amp; Vitamin D relationship?

Solar UV at surface taken from a satellite:




Solar UV zones map:



The same map with text about solar UV index - very good:

http://maps.grida.no/go/graphic/the-global-solar-uv-index

.

[mixin]

Re: Cytokine Storm &amp; Vitamin D relationship?

We had a discussion on the open air treatment of some of the 1918 patients. The really sick ones were put outside in the sun and fresh air and they had a much higher survival rate than those who remained inside. It might be another argument for the benefits of vit D

http://www.flutrackers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=84331